more abstract hardware

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more abstract hardware

Postby Ravener96 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 10:35 am

i might be slightly out of the loop, but it seems a lot of stuff is getting simulated quite acuratly, do we have to simulate everything (or even that much?)?
as long as the computer functions with moderate to good realism i am satisfied. data can be transferred with generic cables, the cpu is just a magic box that runs programs and floppy discs are just buckets of a limited size you can pour data into and retrieve later by requesting the name of the file you saved(or number or something). lots of stuff can be cut out without significant loss in gameplay, but with significant gain in usability and amount of data you can handle at once.
even the assembly code can be cut slightly and just be another way of saying the same things, we assume that the DCPU has a converter so it understands both assembly(as if it is the native language) and c or something similar)

it has been some weeks since i read what we were doing so forgive me if/when i am repeating the obvious or am being ridicolusly out of touch with trillek.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby S0lll0s » Fri Nov 29, 2013 1:24 pm

Well the CPU definetely won't become a C interpreter. And "converters" are called compilers.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby VladVP » Fri Nov 29, 2013 5:56 pm

Where's the fun for programmers when it's basically a hardware C compiler? I think this is a very bad idea.
Also, something you haven't taken into account is the fact that parsing a C file is MUCH harder than simply reading machine code. It would really generate quite a damn bit of lag if the server had to take care of that as well.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Zardoz » Fri Nov 29, 2013 7:19 pm

VladVP wrote:Where's the fun for programmers when it's basically a hardware C compiler? I think this is a very bad idea.
Also, something you haven't taken into account is the fact that parsing a C file is MUCH harder than simply reading machine code. It would really generate quite a damn bit of lag if the server had to take care of that as well.


I totally agree.

But we can try some particular tasks more easy and abstract that should be in real world. For example, using a floppy by asking a particular sector, instead driving the floppy motor and headers as in a PC does actually.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby S0lll0s » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:21 pm

Zardoz wrote:
VladVP wrote:Where's the fun for programmers when it's basically a hardware C compiler? I think this is a very bad idea.
Also, something you haven't taken into account is the fact that parsing a C file is MUCH harder than simply reading machine code. It would really generate quite a damn bit of lag if the server had to take care of that as well.


I totally agree.

But we can try some particular tasks more easy and abstract that should be in real world. For example, using a floppy by asking a particular sector, instead driving the floppy motor and headers as in a PC does actually.

Of course abstraction to a certain degree is good, and I think that the degree notch chose in his hardware specs is pretty balanced and more or less "perfect"
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Ravener96 » Sun Dec 01, 2013 11:19 pm

Sorry, forgot the word "compiler".
The reason to make the cpu work in both c and machine code is that since most code would be written with c, it would ease the running of it as the program could just run it instead of simulating everything as if a viritual computer is using c programs... Those of us that know mashine code would be free to do so and make all kinds of awesome shaz.
This whole suggestion is just a way to ease the use of some stuff while making it WAY lighter on your cpu.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Zardoz » Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:26 am

Hold on!. If I understand you correctly... You are talking of using something like LUA OS, but with C instead of LUA ?
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Krarl » Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:55 am

The point of asm is that there should be a realistic base for everything else. Programming in asm isn't better than higher languages, I want to code in something that's easier, like c, but the whole point of realistic computers is that I compile my c to machine code, like in real life.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Ravener96 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 11:50 am

Zardoz wrote:Hold on!. If I understand you correctly... You are talking of using something like LUA OS, but with C instead of LUA ?

dunno, i am not that good a programmer, i have used some c, lots of html and java (disgrace). but maybe... i think?
the idea is just that you can run things in c directly as c without going thrugh a compiler that makes it into less eficient code while you also can run machine code like always.
you could tell the machine to use c by using a special header or something (god, html words). all the other things in my OP is things that we can assume the devices handle themselves, like filenames and such, not as certain on those though.
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Re: more abstract hardware

Postby Zardoz » Mon Dec 02, 2013 2:08 pm

You should know that a interpreter of C that you can find or anybody can create will be less efficient that compiled code.
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