Weapons (Ship and Player)

Post here all of your ideas, concept and suggestions which aren't strictly related to the game's development and implementation!

Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Mon Dec 16, 2013 11:07 pm

Weapons are probably something that should wait until ship and player damage gets sorted out, but I still think it would be nice to start creating concepts now.

SHIP:In my "Shields" thread (link:http://forum.trillek.org/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=723) I suggested that shields could not fully protect a ship from radiation, electromagnetic radiation to be specific, and that while projectiles were completely destroyed by a shield, they weakened the shield. Basing ship-based weapons off my concept for shielding, this leads to two obvious types of onboard weapons: lasers and cannons, each with their own pros and cons.
Lasers: can either be powered by the ship (e.g. flash lamp/diode/free electron lasers) or by "ammo" (chemical lasers). Powered-by-ship lasers don't have to be reloaded, but do use up vital power, whereas lasers that use some type of "ammo" are independent of the generator yet have to be reloaded. At this simplicity the two options for lasers are balanced, so the choice of laser can be made depending on each player's ship layout and requirements, or the player can choose not to use lasers at all. Different wavelengths of laser radiation can have different uses, for example light (the portion of radiation that gets past the shields) can be used to melt the hull and gamma rays can penetrate the hull to go straight for the crew.
Cannons: look at the variety of guns that exist today. They can have a high or low fire-rate and caliber, and shoot a range of different projectiles (exploding, armor-piercing, pellets, etc.). They can be chemically fueled (gunpowder, which works in space btw) or powered by the ship (railguns and coilguns), just like the lasers I mentioned above. One disadvantage is that the projectiles have to be stored in the ship, taking up volume and increasing the mass of the ship. Since the shield concept I suggested uses heat to protect against projectiles, shield-proof bullets can exist as well, including high velocity, high mass and/or high specific heat capacity bullets.

PLAYER:Like in ships, both lasers and bullets should be effective against enemies. However, a lot of the game is centered around the ship, so inter-ship combat should be addressed. If the player's ship was boarded by pirates, both the pirates' and (I hope) the player's priority would be to keep the ship intact. So no laser beams or lead cylinders flying about the place. For projectile weapons, rubber bullets and taser bullets would probably do the job of at least stalling the enemy. For a more futuristic feel there are a number of directed energy weapons used to deter people without permanent harm, including microwave beams and electrolasers.

While on the topic of weapons, if any of the sound guys end up reading this, I would like to state that I'm not a fan of the "pew pew" laser sounds and (I hope I don't sound like too much of a demanding asshole) I would prefer a more realistic capacitor discharge sound.

Please voice your ideas and opinions, I don't care if you shoot me down (o.k. the pun was intended) and, as always, thanks for reading.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Tue Dec 17, 2013 2:51 pm

I completely forgot about knives and other melee weapons. Something like a katana would be pretty badass. At the same time I don't think people want this to become more of a fantasy style game (me included), so sword and shield combat might be a no-go.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby sleuthyRogue » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:14 pm

I feel melee weapons would be the ONLY way to put someone out of commission permanently with little to no damage to the ship. It would definitely give the game a different and almost novel feel, having to chase enemies around, stun them, and then rush them quickly to put them down. Certainly much different than the average "pew-pew-you're-dead" combat system.

The other aspect of such a combat one should consider would be the fact that teams of invaders or defenders can hold off someone trying to rush a downed teammate. Such exchanges of losses would make combat pretty back and forth, not to mention intense. It should also be considered, however, that "lone-wolf" guerrilla tactics should also be catered to, as not everyone is in it for teams. Short-term personal cloaking devices perhaps? Five seconds of stealth can make all the difference in the world.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby Zardoz » Tue Dec 17, 2013 5:36 pm

My thoughts about weaponry are :

Ships :
Some weapons can have different mounting options, like :
  • Point of Defense -> High speed aiming, low damage, low power usage (if apply)
  • Normal
  • Huge -> Extra damage and/or range, more power usage (if apply), low speed aiming
  • Extra Huge -> More Extra damage and/or range, more power usage (if apply), lowest speed aiming
  • Axial -> No aiming or very restricted (few degress), bigger damage and/or range, and bigger power usage (if apply)
Weapon types
  • Energy Weapons :
    - Lasers : Medium to High power consumption, high accuracy, very long range . Possible mechanics that could be added -> Heating (too hot and could get broken) and Overloading (Overload to get extra damage but can get broken, plus get more hot quickly). Possible variant that uses ammo (chemical powered). All mount sizes.
    - Particle Beams : High power consumption, short range, medium accuracy and high damage. Mounts from standard to axial
    - Cold Plasma Stream : Low power, very short range. Only effective against shields. Mounts from standard to axial
  • Warhead Weapons (use ammo) :
    - Mines : Variations -> Standard, Low Profile (cloak), EMP, LeapFrog (moves to the next body inside a small radius)
    - Missiles : Can do corrections, but are very easy to track and destroy by Point Defense weapons
    - Dumb Missiles : Less size but launched in swarms so could overload Point of Defense weapons.
    - Anti-Missile missile : Only targets other missiles, high speed and high course correction capacity, but short range.

    Mounts here not apply

    Both Missiles and dumb missiles could have this variations :
    - Standard
    - Chaff (make sensors less effective, but can't damage anything)
    Normal missiles also can have this variations :
    - EMP
    - Cluster/MIRV
  • Projectile Weapons (use ammo) :
    - Gauss cannon (Coil gun) : High power usage, very high kinetic damage (It's AP always), medium to high accuracy. Possible mechanics to add : Overload and Heat . Mounts from standard to axial
    - Chemical auto-cannon : Minimal power usage, high fire rate, low accuracy. Possible mechanics to add: Heat . Mounts from Point of Defense to Huge. Variations of ammo : HE, AP

Players :
  • Masers (Microwave laser) : Only damage living things and unshielded electronics (Yep, the space "gun" of Space 1999), few shots before running out of power.
  • Lasers : Few shots before running out of power.
  • Tasser
  • Chemical guns
  • Electro-Chemical gun : See "Metal storm" in youtube
  • Grenade : Flash and Explosive types
  • White weapons like knifes, etc....

EDIT: Space 1999 is what do you call "Moon Base Alpha"... here was called "Espacio 1999"
Last edited by Zardoz on Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:13 pm

sleuthyRogue: If you've ever played Assault on Dark Athena there's plenty of snooping around a ship in the shadows. Although there are guns, a lot of combat is done by sneaking up on the enemy and this aspect of the game has a really nice feel to it. If the ship's lighting could be controlled by the CPU and there were a good amount of hiding places on the ship (e.g. behind crates or on a walkway above a room) a really fun and somewhat challenging combat style could be used. If there were sneak attacks in the game it would make this even better. As for stealth, darkness might be good enough. It depends on if a realistic cloaking device could be conceived or not.

Zardoz: I can't say anything more as you've covered it all. As for powering the hand-held weapons, there's a thread on batteries where any ideas should be put. Like you said some weapons should use more power (all wavelengths of laser, with shorter wavelengths using more) while the less dangerous ones (taser) use less power.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby VladVP » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:29 pm

Heavy artillery:
What about shells made from one halve of negative mass matter, and one of positive mass. Preferably of a very heavy isotope.

I'd suggest a shell made from Image like this:

Image


It would continue accelerating in a single direction forever, until all of the matter with negative mass completely explodes into a cloud of subatomic particles. The challenge would then just be to keep the negative matter together until it the shell is able to reach something...

That's an idea at least... not very practical, I know... but at least we can do a lot of other cool things using this method!

You know what? Disregard all of the above... I'll make a thread about negative mass now.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Tue Dec 17, 2013 8:36 pm

VladVP wrote:You know what? Disregard all of the above... I'll make a thread about negative mass now.

Good idea, seeing that negative mass also plays a part in Alcubierre drives (if thats the FTL drive that will be included in the game) and could allow for anti-gravity devices, which have a strong foothold in sci-fi.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby Zardoz » Tue Dec 17, 2013 10:47 pm

VladVP wrote:It would continue accelerating in a single direction forever, until all of the matter with negative mass completely explodes into a cloud of subatomic particles. The challenge would then just be to keep the negative matter together until it the shell is able to reach something...


Goodbye termodynamic, Hello Nyan cat!


PD: You just describe a Nyan cat with complex physics stuff. ;)
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:37 pm

For the artists out there, I though this would make a cool laser gun "barrel" : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Ruby_laser_pumping_cavity_assembled_and_disassembled.JPG
It's a bit bulky, but I think that fits the 80's style. The terminals for the flash lamps look like they might be in the way a bit, so they could be sticking out the back instead. Exposed wires on the back of the gun would look nice in my opinion and add to the "scavenged tech" side of things.
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Re: Weapons (Ship and Player)

Postby ConnorY71 » Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:10 pm

Look what I ran into on stumbleupon:http://josephshoer.com/blog/2009/12/thoughts-on-space-battles/. Definitely worth reading. All credit to Joseph Shoer, the author.
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